Episode 820: Is Your Website Costing You Ad Revenue With Jennifer Holt

EBT820 – Jennifer Holt

Intro 00:00

Food bloggers. Hi, how are you today? Thank you so much for tuning in to the Eat Blog Talk podcast. This is the place for food bloggers to get information and inspiration to accelerate your blog’s growth, and ultimately help you to achieve your freedom. Whether that’s financial, personal, or professional. I’m Megan Porta. I have been a food blogger for 13 years, so I understand how isolating food blogging can be. I’m on a mission to motivate, inspire, and most importantly, let each and every food blogger, including you, know that you are heard and supported. 

[00:01] Megan Porta

Hello Jen, welcome. How are you?

[00:03] Jen Holt

I’m so good. Thank you for having me. Excited to be here.

[00:06] Megan Porta

Yeah, super excited to have you today. And I’m excited about our topic, which is just how your website structure can impact your ad income, which impacts your revenue and your livelihood. So I think this is a very important conversation to have today. So can you just give people a background on you? Who are you and what do you do?

[00:18] Jen Holt

Yes, absolutely. I’m Jen Holt and I am the website designer at Jennifer Holt Designs. I know, very exciting name. Spent so much time really thinking that one out. I thought later, hmm, maybe you could have gotten a little more creative, but I specialize in food blogs and helping people maximize their website for more ad income, more ad revenue. And really that’s the goal. Like you said, at the end of the day, it’s to make a little more money where we can.

[00:34] Megan Porta

That works, yeah.

[00:55] Megan Porta

Yeah, right. And that is the bread and butter for a lot of food bloggers. So really kind of juicing that as much as we can is smart, I think, especially now when things are kind of all over the place in many different realms. So this is an important conversation. So thank you for showing up with this today.

[00:59] Jen Holt

Yes, thank you.

[01:16] Megan Porta

Yeah. So I guess we could just start off with what we just said. Why is our blog such an important part of our strategy? I mean, obviously monetization. What other thoughts do you have on that?

[01:29] Jen Holt

Well, you know, so many people spend a lot of time thinking about traffic. And obviously traffic is a huge component. But a lot of times we’re thinking more about getting traffic from all the places to the site that we don’t actually think about what are we doing with people when we get them to the site? We want them to read a recipe, we want them to utilize all the things that we have there. But are we really giving them a strategic way to interact with our content? I think so many times we miss the mark because we’re thinking, “I want them to read this recipe.” Yes, that’s step one. But then what? Do you want them to stay longer? Because we know that longer sessions equal more ad income. We know that multiple page views is more ad income. And so the idea is always: yes, it should be beautiful — I mean, I’m a website designer, so of course I appreciate a beautiful website — but it’s about the strategy, and how that strategy guides every other decision you make on the structure, so that when the reader gets there, it is so intuitive that it feels to them like, “How did she know that I was literally going to ask that next question before I even posed it?”

[02:39] Megan Porta

Yeah, that makes sense. So just giving some thought about how you structure everything. So can you talk about specifically for a recipe post, how can we structure so that it’s, I guess, better optimized for the user or better optimized for ad performance?

[03:01] Jen Holt

Yes, okay. So for a recipe itself, always you want to be thinking, especially with AEO, GEO — you know, it used to just be SEO, now there’s about 4,000 EOs that are part of the equation — but we want to think about having snippets that can be pulled over into the AI-generated snippet that shows up in Google. So you want to have a quick answer, an easily grabbable one- or two-sentence summary of the recipe itself. Food bloggers have been doing this for a long time, and that’s really good. But if you can beef that up just a tiny bit — add a little twist, something that’s going to answer multiple queries someone might be asking — you want to have that pretty high up in the introduction. Of course, images — we’ve got to have those gorgeous images. And then you want to always be sure to have a jump-to-recipe option for the person who’s like, “I have five minutes and I’ve spent four of them trying to get to this recipe. I literally just need the recipe.” But for SEO, AEO, GEO, and the people who really want to know more behind the scenes, that’s when you give them the lay of the land: here’s what we’re using, here’s what you need, here’s what you don’t need. And then you’re giving them variations, and linking within the article itself to other relevant topics. So let’s say you’re making pepperoni pizza and you write, “Check out my homemade marinara sauce, it’s way easier than you think.” Now, guess what — now they’re visiting two recipes. Even though they’re in a hurry, maybe they think, “Actually, I forgot my marinara sauce — okay, I can make it from scratch with three ingredients. Say less, I’m jumping over to that recipe.”

[04:59] Jen Holt

And so that internal linking structure is really important, because most of us, when we think of internal linking, we think, “I’ve got to put that related-recipes plug-in at the bottom of my article.” And somebody’s reading about pepperoni pizza, and you’ve got a smoothie recipe that got pulled in randomly — a smoothie recipe, a cake recipe, a turkey recipe. Who’s going to click that if they’re reading about pizza? That’s just not even in the wheelhouse.

[05:24] Megan Porta

Right. It’s not relevant, yeah.

[05:29] Jen Holt

So if you can think about creating little blocks that are ultra relevant to the content the person is already consuming, and linking out to how-to guides — for example, apparently pepperoni pizza is where it’s at, so I’m like, “I need a pizza, can someone go make me a pizza?” — but when you’re thinking about how to make pizza dough from scratch, that’s going to be more of a how-to guide as opposed to just making the thing. So we’re always thinking about almost two user experiences as we’re creating recipe posts. If it’s just a recipe, you start at the beginning and do the things you’ve always done. If it’s a how-to guide, this user is coming with a very different intention on how they’re going to process, read, and consume the information. Person one, who’s just looking for the recipe, is probably going to grab it and bounce. It’s still important, though, to do the internal linking work for the person who does want to browse around and has the opportunity to bounce elsewhere within your website. Person two is searching something like “how to make pepperoni pizza.” They land on your recipe post, and then there’s a guide that shows them how to make homemade crust, and another guide on how to make sure their sourdough turns out perfect every time. This second person is in research mode — they want a long, lengthy piece of content that teaches them a skill. Very different from the mom who has three minutes to get food on the table. Understanding that changes the format entirely.

[07:26] Megan Porta

That’s so interesting. I’ve never thought about it like that. So the way people word their search has a completely different intent — if they search “how to make pepperoni pizza,” wow, okay, that’s so interesting.

[07:34] Jen Holt

It does, yes. Isn’t it? It really changes the landscape of what it looks like when we’re creating content — not just the content itself, but how it looks. So, for example, someone searching “quick pepperoni pizza” or “pepperoni pizza recipe” versus “how to make pepperoni pizza” — the person who wants to know how to make it is thinking, “Please teach me this skill, I don’t know how to do this, I need very step-by-step stuff.” Then you’re also offering, “Do you want to learn more within this very robust guide?” And these are usually a little more topically zoomed out than just, say, pepperoni pizza — maybe it’s “how to make sure your cakes turn out perfect every single time.” So you’re telling them everything they need to do, but also what they can expect — and if they make a mistake, most likely what’s happened. If it falls in the middle, I guarantee this is what’s going on — you’re at a higher elevation, you’re going to want to take that into account.

[09:01] Jen Holt

Now, these aren’t the types of questions you’d traditionally answer in, say, a red velvet cake recipe, but they are when somebody’s searching “how to make cakes right every time” or something along those lines. Those types of posts are where I feel like so many recipe bloggers are missing a beautiful opportunity to get more value from the traffic they already have. Because these people already like them — they’re coming back repeatedly, and we want repeat visitors, right? We always want people coming back for more content. So obviously they like the way you do things, so teach them more. You can leverage the audience you already have and give them a wealth of information. And you may think, “Well, I don’t really know that much” — you’d be shocked at how much you actually know when you go back to the foundation of what you share on your site.

[10:03] Megan Porta

Okay, so we obviously can’t do this for every post — not every recipe post would apply — but if we have extensive knowledge on a topic, do we go back to some of our older content and update it that way, thinking through the how-to instead of just the pepperoni pizza recipe?

[10:28] Jen Holt

Yes, I think this is where the whole site structure comes into play. When you’re thinking about the categories you feature on your recipe site, a sourdough blogger is going to have very different categories than someone who’s a grill master — totally different clientele going to those websites. So the first thing you need to understand about your site is: who are you serving, and what are they coming here for? If someone is going to a sourdough site, chances are they’re generally okay with longer, drawn-out processes for their recipes. You’ve got a blog over here where everything’s 30 minutes or less — “I don’t want sourdough, I don’t have time for that.” Understanding that directs the choices you make on the types of guides you offer. So maybe on the sourdough side it’s a “beginner sourdough guide,” teaching all the things and the terminology — maybe it’s “sourdough terms 101,” a fun little “here’s what this means, here’s this word, here’s how you pronounce it” — because I couldn’t pronounce it if I tried — and “here’s what the equipment looks like, this is what I’m talking about.” That way, when they see that language in a recipe, they already know, because if they don’t, you can point them to that beginner guide. And over on the other side, the 30-minute meals, that’s a totally different guide — maybe an entire guide on meal prep. And when I say guide, I mean a blog post, but you can also make it a PDF if you want. What happens is, you think about the highest-level categories on your site that you have a lot of articles about. So if “30-minute meals” is one of your primo categories, go through and think — perhaps it’s divided up by beef, chicken, and other proteins — you should have something related to beef, like “fast beef recipes.” This is where AI can be really helpful, just to brainstorm what would make a great singular guide that teaches people a skill related to all the articles or recipes they’re already loving — giving them all your best, most helpful tips for everything they’re going to run into. And here’s the key: you use that piece of content to link out to 10, 15, or 20 of those specific recipes. Think of it almost as a little mini blog related to that category. Does that make sense?

[13:44] Megan Porta

Okay, yeah, that does make sense. So let’s say nobody’s doing this — say they have a blog with a ton of content, like I do, a thousand or so recipes, and they’ve never thought through a structure like this. Would you recommend just going to some of the main categories on their blog and working through it that way?

[14:05] Jen Holt

I think what I would do — this is if one of my clients asked me, “Okay, I’ve got a thousand recipes, where do I even start?” Because that’s the biggest hurdle: everything feels important, so where on earth do you begin? Here’s what I’d suggest. First and foremost, what are your top-performing posts? Are there any patterns — any where you’re thinking, “My goodness, how did I miss this before?” Because sometimes when we look at the data, it’s so clear, and we think we know something we don’t actually know. With Thanksgiving coming up, put together a guide for Thanksgiving and Christmas, grouping together the posts and recipes you have related to that. Maybe it’s “the ultimate Thanksgiving meal in two hours or less” for the quick-recipe crowd — all your 30-minute things, everything they can prep ahead of time. Now they can leverage all that traffic you know you’re going to get at Thanksgiving anyway. And you’ve got a long, lengthy guide going into it — not something they’ll read on the day of Thanksgiving, but something you share in October, as people are thinking, preparing, and planning, so it’s there for them ready — plus the 20 most popular Thanksgiving recipes. Because one thing people also don’t realize is that RPMs shift depending on the time of year. A pumpkin pie recipe might get $20 RPMs at any normal point during the year, but those RPMs might jump to $70 for that same post during a very small window. So leverage that article by making sure you’re presenting how to get to it and linking it everywhere. Make a new category relevant to Thanksgiving, make one relevant to Christmas, and don’t put every generic recipe in there — highly curate the content. Because we want everybody to look at everything, so everything ends up in every category, and that’s actually not helpful for the reader. I’m guilty of it too — I think we’re all guilty of it at times.

[16:44] Megan Porta

Yeah, that makes sense too. And Pinterest — I think some of those guides you’re talking about, like a Thanksgiving guide or Christmas guide, are so highly relevant there. Google, yes, but Pinterest is really where people look for that sort of food content.

[17:07] Jen Holt

Yes, I agree. Pinterest is absolutely going to be your very best friend as a food creator. And then the quicker social channels — Facebook, TikTok, Instagram — you can put that there too. Because people are already in that mindset, thinking, “I want to make this easier on you, I’ve put together this guide, I’m telling you all my behind-the-scenes secrets,” and people respond with, “Say less, just send it to me.” You’re upping your ad revenue just by leveraging the traffic you already have, and giving them something new without actually creating something totally new.

[17:52] Megan Porta

Right, gosh, my wheels are turning. When you have this much content sitting there, it’s like — I’m in this space right now where I’m not creating new content because I know I have so much to leverage. So I’m looking for ways to do that right now, and it’s still September, so I have time to put stuff like this together. And I do have a unique spin too, like everybody does — sometimes you see your content and you don’t know what makes it unique, so maybe run it through ChatGPT or Claude and see if you can get an AI perspective on the theme, what makes you different, what angle you can use.

[18:37] Jen Holt

Yes, and sometimes just asking, “What patterns do you see?” Because patterns help us make good, meaty categories that people want to search. And a recipe index is really important in this respect too — when I say recipe index, people think of different things. The best types of recipe indexes are filterable by multiple filters. Say we’re at Thanksgiving — if I want Thanksgiving side dishes, French fries probably wouldn’t show up, because that’s not a traditional Thanksgiving side. But if I go to a recipe index I can filter by “Thanksgiving sides” or “Thanksgiving pies,” now instead of a thousand recipes, or even a hundred, I have 20 to look at. Now you’ve got my interest, and I can search the way I want to search. Because when we’re putting together our categories and curating content, we have certain patterns in our own minds, but other people would categorize things completely differently. And unless your recipe index lets them drill down — which is basically exactly what Pinterest is, a huge search index — unless they can drill down to exactly what they’re looking for, most people are going to get frustrated, especially with a thousand recipes or something astronomical like that. They’ll get frustrated and walk away, thinking, “I don’t have time for this.” And we don’t want all that great content that’s been there for years to get hidden, because so many times people say, “I forgot I even had that recipe” — they made it 10 years ago, and it’s such a good recipe, but it’s just a hidden gem. This gives people the opportunity to search according to their need, in a way that makes sense to them, and gives them the exact results they want every time. That’s a really helpful page to have on your site — not just “dinners.” I may not think of a hamburger as dinner, maybe I think of it as a sandwich, but people think of things differently. Having that ability to drill down on their own is a really nice feature to have on a website.

[21:27] Megan Porta

Yeah, something you said really changed my perspective, because I think we all think like this at times — the more information I can give people, the more helpful I’m being. But that’s not necessarily the case, because people get overwhelmed easily. If they see a database of 150 recipes they have to scroll through, that’s a click away. But if you give them 12 recipes to look through, that’s so much better. So it’s changing from “more is better” to maybe “less is actually better.”

[21:58] Jen Holt

Yes. And even further than that, curated is best. Curating really takes time — and this is the hardest part, because so much of the work doesn’t feel like you’re doing something, it’s thinking, and that can feel like “I’m not doing anything.” So when we’re curating, we’re asking, “If I am this person, what do I want?” I do the who, what, when, where, how — basic stuff. All of my formal education is in education, I have a bachelor’s and a master’s degree in it, so I’m always asking questions and wanting to learn. I’m always thinking, when I come to someone’s site and I know nothing about it, what do I want to find? Put yourself in the perspective of someone with no experience — you come to a site and suddenly feel like you’re jumping into the middle of something, you’re overwhelmed immediately, and you leave. Like you said, it’s too much. But if a site says, “Hey, if you’re new here, check out my beginner guide to sourdough, I break down everything you’re going to want to know” — thank you, because you saw me before I even started reading the recipe.

[23:25] Megan Porta

Yeah, no, that makes so much sense. I’m thinking about Pinterest strategies and ways to think around that. And this year I think it’s so important to think like this, because things are different — there have been fluctuations with traffic across the board for food bloggers. So thinking a little differently, rather than just going back to last year’s content and updating it — that used to be a good strategy, but now we need to be a little smarter about how we package and offer our content.

[24:00] Jen Holt

I think so. And with AI too — I know that’s a big concern for a lot of creators, and a valid one. If we’re being totally transparent and honest, it’s a valid concern. But personally, I don’t think AI will ever be able to replicate the human heart, the human spirit, in that respect. So if we constantly think about people as people — if I were sitting here with you in the kitchen, making this together, and I saw you do something, what would I tell you? I’d say, “No, no, no, we’re not melting the butter, we’re warming the butter.” What would I tell my teen if I were trying to teach them this? Make it relational and conversational. I think that’s what people are missing so much now — everything feels so mass-produced that nothing feels relational in our conversations. That doesn’t mean you have to write a 5,000-word post about pepperoni pizza starting from the beginning of time when pepperonis were invented — unless that’s your thing, in which case, I’m here for it. But for the most part it’s like, “Here’s pepperoni pizza, I like it, but also, which camp are you in — do you blot the grease off the top of the pepperoni with a napkin, or do you eat it?” That’s the kind of silliness — AI doesn’t think like that, people do. And I always go back to: whatever article you’re writing, whatever content you’re creating, however you’re structuring your site, think about people. Yes, it’s important for SEO and GEO and to follow all the rules, but at the end of the day, think about what a person would want, and you’ll always be on the right track.

[26:17] Megan Porta

Gosh, this is so good. Okay, taking all this to heart, and I know my listeners will too. Thank you, Jen. Is there anything else — other things we can think through, mistakes to avoid, to optimize all of this in the best way?

[26:33] Jen Holt

Yeah, there are so many little things we can do that make everything a much better experience. One thing I’ll say is: don’t always assume more traffic is the first problem you need to solve. Think about the value people get when they arrive — what kind of experience are you providing? Have you created a journey for them? I’ll be honest, it’s work to do this, but there are things you can do from the outside in. Thinking more generally about your whole site: is your navigation intuitive? Can people quickly get where they need to get, or do they need to drill down? Do you need subcategories, or do you need to get rid of some? Both questions are equally relevant — sometimes we have too much, and, like you said, too much is overwhelming. But navigation needs to be so intuitive and clear that people can get wherever they need to go, because a lot of times people land on your site through a specific recipe they found on Pinterest or Instagram. That top navigation is possibly the only other real interaction they’ll have with your site outside of that one article. So make it so easy a caveman could get from point A to point B — no offense to any cavemen out there. And does your homepage guide people? Does it take them to the most important places? If it doesn’t, switch some stuff around — it’s almost so simple it feels like there has to be more to it. But if you start with some of this, it’s like pulling back an onion layer, and you start making connections. And check everything on mobile. I work on a computer or laptop constantly because I’m a website designer, and many of us do our work on laptops — but mobile is a very different experience. You need to make sure all your buttons are clickable and your ads aren’t overlaying buttons or navigation elsewhere. Something I noticed recently on a client’s site: we were building a mobile recipe index with a modal that popped open so people could apply filters, and the “apply filters” button was behind the ads popping up from the bottom. Thankfully we caught it quickly, so we reached out to Raptive and asked if we could change the z-index — how far forward or back something sits in the layers — so the button stayed in front of the ad on the modal, while the ad could still pop up behind it. So check that kind of thing, because it may be the reason you saw a drop — something popping over something people can’t access. Sometimes it’s as simple as re-looking at your site.

[30:43] Megan Porta

Interesting. Yeah, and that’s an easy fix too. I’ve been trying — I got in the habit of updating something, publishing it, and walking away without checking it, even on desktop. The other day I was looking through recent content and found a quote block I’d created with nothing in it — just this big quote mark sitting there. I thought, “That’s been there for a couple of weeks, people were probably like, what is she doing?” So it really pays off to double-check your work. It takes like thirty seconds to look through a site after you’ve touched it. So worthwhile.

[31:39] Jen Holt

It does. You could also have a friend — if you’re both food bloggers, say, “You check my site, I’ll check yours,” and just do a quick glance with no other context. Because so many times, one of the easiest things I see is a post where they forgot to add a featured image, so it’s not pulling in on the archive pages — and it’s just a simple click, select, done.

[31:44] Megan Porta

Yeah, that’s a good idea.

[32:05] Megan Porta

Yeah, it just takes a few minutes, or a few seconds really. And you mentioned this a little earlier — internal linking. Do you have any further thoughts on that? I know you mentioned being intentional and using helpful links. Anything beyond that?

[32:24] Jen Holt

Yes. Well, one thing I’ll say about internal linking: I always turn off the “related posts” widget or plug-in on my clients’ websites immediately, because it’s so random. It’s not worth your time or the space — let’s be honest, when we’ve got ads and other content, real estate is prime, we need only helpful stuff populating it. So don’t even do that. If you’re going to add something related, go back to that word “curate” — curate stuff the reader actually wants, and start with your most popular content, because it’s already getting increased traffic, so say, “Hey, while you’re here, why don’t you check out this?” That’s the smartest way to approach it. And anywhere else it makes sense — back to pepperoni pizza — you might write, “You can absolutely grab a jar of marinara at the store, or I’ve got a super quick five-minute homemade marinara sauce, check that out.” You’re better off, with internal linking, not saying “click here” and highlighting those words. You want it to say “homemade marinara sauce” or “marinara sauce from scratch” — something descriptive for SEO purposes, so when Google crawls your site, it understands the spider-webbing of internal links: “I’m headed over here to this marinara sauce,” or “how to save money on shredded cheese,” maybe linking to your guide on shredding your own cheese and keeping it from molding. Then, naturally, where they’re reading about shredded cheese, you say, “You can buy this pre-shredded to save time, or if budget matters more to you, check out my shredded cheese on a dime guide.” Wherever it makes sense — “here’s two options, whichever suits you, go for it.” But if I have a guide, I’m absolutely going to link to it. Then create a little box of maybe three to five highly related posts — for pepperoni pizza, maybe homemade marinara sauce, cheese pizza, Supreme pizza, or Italian recipes — whatever makes sense, but it has to be strategic. Mix it up instead of just posting plain text links like “homemade marinara sauce” — do some with a picture and title too, to change it up, because you don’t know what’s going to catch someone’s eye. Let’s be honest, it’s competing a little with the ads — ads are a necessary evil on our sites, so make sure your content stands apart. Maybe make it a block, put an outline around it, change the background color so it stands out against visually heavy ads. Present it in multiple ways. And then, for those big, deep how-to guides that are relevant, link in and out to those too — you’re creating an ecosystem, rather than just sharing recipes. Yes, you share recipes, but you have a whole system for all the things.

[36:38] Megan Porta

Yeah, that’s the perfect word for everything you’re describing here. And what you said earlier might come into play too with internal linking — having somebody else, maybe a blogger, or just a friend who enjoys cooking, or someone who’s learning to cook, like the teens you mentioned, give you feedback like, “This isn’t really helpful,” or “I could really use a guide on this,” and then taking that feedback and curating your ecosystem that way.

[37:08] Jen Holt

Yes. And one other place I didn’t mention earlier that I just thought of: what are the questions you get asked all the time? We overlook this so much — email, Instagram, TikTok DMs, or even comments. If someone comments, “I tried this but had this issue,” address it — put a block in there about your suggestion for how to make it better. We actually have more insight from comments, messages, and emails than we may think. You might realize, “This is more than just a two- or three-sentence answer, this could be a whole guide.” You’ll start making connections to content you already have, and you’ll think, “My goodness, I have so many great ideas I don’t know where to start.” Then hand that guide over to somebody, especially if they don’t know how to cook, and say, “I know you have no context for this — read it and tell me, does this make sense, could you follow this?” And if they say yes, publish it, you’re good to go.

[38:26] Megan Porta

Yeah, I did this kind of accidentally, but the other day I ran a URL through AI asking for questions people ask, refining those, and it pulled out a few comments — it read the comments and told me, “You might want to consider putting an answer about this in your post because two people have asked in the comments.” So instead of sorting through every comment yourself, you can run it through AI and then add humanity to it and answer. But I thought that was an unintentional, brilliant thing that happened.

[38:56] Jen Holt

Yes, exactly. Certainly. Absolutely — that’s how I think of AI, as such a helpful tool for the monotonous parts where you need to get to an answer. It can do that part for you. Then when you get it, you think, “Now how will I answer that? How will I make this me?” That’s the gold we can find when using AI, for sure.

[39:34] Megan Porta

Yeah, for sure. Okay, I love this conversation so much, Jen — I feel like I could talk to you endlessly. But just to wrap up, is there anything else you wanted to say that would be helpful that we haven’t covered yet?

[39:50] Jen Holt

I think the biggest thing is knowing that no matter where you are in the journey — just starting out, or doing this for a hundred years — sometimes you need to take a step back and think: “What am I seeing right now? Where am I headed? Is what I’m doing now, where I’m spending my time and energy, getting me closer to where I want to go?” If it’s not, step back and reassess. Maybe you’re working on something and realize, “That’s not getting me anywhere near where I need to be.” We should be doing that reassessment constantly in business anyway, but especially if you’re noticing a downward trend in views or ad revenue, run these things we’ve talked about through and see what you find on your site. It may be that you’ve outgrown your DIY site — that’s what I notice a lot with my clients, their ecosystem has outgrown the home they created it in. That’s when we start getting really strategic, crossing every T and dotting every I, to make sure they’re not leaving money on the table. So if you have a DIY site, it may be time to invest in something more strategic — DIY has served you well up to this point, that can’t be overstated, but at some point you have to decide to keep doing what you’re doing or do something different.

[41:33] Megan Porta

Yeah, so much to think about. I have an agenda for today, but I just want to throw it out and think through this instead. Thank you — this gives us so much to think about as we head into Q4, which is right around the corner. And I like that you also gave us a few small things, like just looking through your homepage — is the navigation clear, does it make sense? Instead of having to overhaul your entire business, you could do some small things — obviously it can turn into a rabbit hole if you really want to make changes, but it doesn’t have to. Thank you, Jen, this was amazing. Remind everyone where they can find you if they’re interested in learning more from you.

[42:25] Jen Holt

Yes, absolutely. You can find me at jenniferholtdesigns.com. I know, the name — ten out of ten, right? No, jenniferholtdesigns.com. I also have a podcast, The Food Bloggers Table, where I talk about a lot of this stuff in even more depth. So you can find it on the website or over on the podcast, and all the social places, you can find me at Jennifer Holt Designs.

[42:51] Megan Porta

Amazing. Well, I hope everyone goes and says hello to you. Thank you again for this amazing conversation, and thanks for listening, Food Blogger. See you next time.

[42:55] Jen Holt

Yes.